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Post by Commissioner on Mar 7, 2023 15:48:16 GMT -5
love this post, great work Commissioner. I would be very excited about this possibility if the AD’s PPG average remains around 25 PPG. For this to happen, we need 9 more games this year and 32 next year. That’s a 23.7 PPG average. 9 games this year would mean a loss in the first round of the NCAA Tournament, but I could be wrong. I think if he can front load this scenario with great success this year, then it’s in the discussion. We can call his campaign the “Catch the Pistol” or “Aim for pistol” or even “Speed past Pete”. This would be a very special accomplishment for AD, our program, the Davis Family, and Kampe 😂 I looked this up because I wanted to flag the very first post in this thread from a year ago, by Mole (which Hyperion here mistakenly attributed to me). But I have to say, I got a kick out of Hyperion's post here. I guess a lot has changed in a year! Let's repeat that: "This would be a very special accomplishment for AD, our program, the Davis Family, and Kampe 😂"
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Post by calihanmole on Mar 7, 2023 17:06:34 GMT -5
Interesting to read those old posts on the subject. Who could have possibly predicted that Antoine would go on such a scoring spree at the end of this season, appear to have the record in round two of the HL, and then fall just a long bucket short? I can appreciate that maybe for Hyperion that the CBI isn’t worth the money for the university in the given moment, but I’d encourage him and others to think of the long term benefit of Antoine holding the record and what it could mean to UDM basketball. No one is saying that this would be equivalent to a Loyola or Saint Peter’s NCAA tourney run. But unlike those tourney runs that fade after a few years, Antoine holding the record would be a point of pride for UDM and the basketball program for at least decades. I still can’t get over how some people talk about this money as if it’s a large amount. The cost to enter is $27,500 from what I understand, and I’d guess we’d need to spend another 20-30K on travel and lodging depending on how many people go and how tight we can squeeze our pennies. As Kirky rightly said on Twitter, if we can’t afford this and don’t go for financial reasons, then we should honestly admit that we no longer have the funding or fan base to continue with D1 athletics. Anyone who’s worked at any university for more than a week knows that this is not a lot of money.
If Hyperion, or others, suggest that we shouldn’t go because it’s “buying” the record for Antoine, I’d push back and say that this extra game gets Antoine the same number of games as Doug McDermott. I believe that McDermott had some games in post season tournaments that were “pay to play.” No one goes around suggesting that McDermott doesn’t rightfully belong as the 7th all time scoring leader. So, what are the differences? As far as I can tell, there are three. First, Antoine had what some call an “extra” season because of COVID. But that’s not really extra when you consider the amount of cancelled games in 2019-2020 and 2020-2021 for the Titans. I swear, some ignorant fucks talk about this as if Antoine himself leaked the COVID virus from the lab in China. Second, Antoine’s final points will come at the CBI, whereas McDermott played in the NCAA tournament his last three season and played in the CBI only in his freshman year when the Jays were runners up (Creighton played 6 games in the CBI, since at that point the champion was decided in a best of three series). Are McDermott’s points “earned” because he was on an NCAA tourney team? I guess people could suggest so. However, I’d suggest that life is all about embracing opportunities that come your way. That’s what winners do. You create your own luck by putting yourself out there, competing, and getting shit done. That’s why the Titans should play and Antoine shouldn’t feel bad for it. He didn’t create COVID and he didn’t create the CBI tournament as a way to rig the system. He’s a young man who loves the game and wants to do his best under the rules and circumstances. Third, finally, is that Antoine will simply have scored more points than McDermott and Maravich (assuming the Titans play in the CBI, which seems obvious that they will at this point).
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Post by uofdfan1983 on Mar 7, 2023 17:51:03 GMT -5
We could go on and on in endless stupid debates: How many points did AD score vs D2 competition compared to Pistol Pete? Did Pistol ever sit out a game vs a D2 opponent (see U-M Dearborn) because the game was a last-minute filler game during the League Schedule because previous games were canceled due to a Pandemic? Did Pistol ever miss a game because his arch-rival refused to make up a game that was postponed due to a Pandemic (see OU last season)? Did Oscar Robertson's family whine about Maravich as he was approaching the Big O's record because Pistol took 40+ shots per game?
Bottom Line: AD is going to get the record after we receive an offer to play. Now let's go out and do something with that opportunity and win a few games and make it a memorable Tourney for more than one reason! And then the whiners can whine and I'll cry my little "I can't hear you" song because I like the Titans a lot more than their team, and because AD is our guy, not theirs.
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Post by hyperion on Mar 7, 2023 21:03:37 GMT -5
love this post, great work Commissioner. I would be very excited about this possibility if the AD’s PPG average remains around 25 PPG. For this to happen, we need 9 more games this year and 32 next year. That’s a 23.7 PPG average. 9 games this year would mean a loss in the first round of the NCAA Tournament, but I could be wrong. I think if he can front load this scenario with great success this year, then it’s in the discussion. We can call his campaign the “Catch the Pistol” or “Aim for pistol” or even “Speed past Pete”. This would be a very special accomplishment for AD, our program, the Davis Family, and Kampe 😂 I looked this up because I wanted to flag the very first post in this thread from a year ago, by Mole (which Hyperion here mistakenly attributed to me). But I have to say, I got a kick out of Hyperion's post here. I guess a lot has changed in a year! Let's repeat that: "This would be a very special accomplishment for AD, our program, the Davis Family, and Kampe 😂"Actually, nothing has changed in a year. We’re still losers. And since you’re pulling old posts, I wrote this after the YSU game: “Strangely, I was obsessed with AD’s quest to get the record tonight. To be honest, I wanted this so bad for him, more so than a team win. It must be a devastating night for Antoine. Antoine has had a storied individual career and will go down as the most prolific scorer in Titan history and the second best scorer in NCAA history. It’s a remarkable run for a tremendous young man, who is about to embark on what promises to be an intriguing and closely watched pro career. As far as the notion of paying to get Antoine another game, I don’t think that is in anyone’s best interest and would appear to be an illegitimate attempt to pad. Let’s enjoy this young man’s success and appreciate this moment for what it is. Someday, I have a feeling that Antoine may become the best second round pick in NBA history. I will be watching and rooting for him.”
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Post by hyperion on Mar 7, 2023 21:05:44 GMT -5
Buying the record is a sham.
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Post by fan on Mar 8, 2023 0:03:56 GMT -5
Why is it a sham, is he joining some other schools for a game or two to pad the points? That would be a sham. He's a college player, he has no say where the school plays. His dads the coach, so it's a sham? Would you be happier if they play the game and he sits out? To me buying the record means he gets the record and doesn't have to play, a sham that's a pretty dumb statement and a slam on AD.
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Post by hyperion on Mar 8, 2023 3:08:32 GMT -5
FAN, there is no doubt in my mind that the negative PR firestorm that is building will have an adverse impact on our school, one that we may never recover from. Prior to the CBI controversy, “the chase” had what I consider a small asterisk associated with it, pertaining to the 5th year and the game played differential. This was irrational and most people dismissed it. AD came just shy of the record which in a remarkable feet. With this CBI controversy, now the asterisk is becoming super sized. Just google “Antoine Davis” and read any new article from the past two days and you’ll see the negative PR on display. This giant asterisk in only going to continue to grow. We are missing the crassness of this situation.
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Post by upbasketballfan on Mar 8, 2023 6:27:41 GMT -5
FAN, there is no doubt in my mind that the negative PR firestorm that is building will have an adverse impact on our school, one that we may never recover from. Prior to the CBI controversy, “the chase” had what I consider a small asterisk associated with it, pertaining to the 5th year and the game played differential. This was irrational and most people dismissed it. AD came just shy of the record which in a remarkable feet. With this CBI controversy, now the asterisk is becoming super sized. Just google “Antoine Davis” and read any new article from the past two days and you’ll see the negative PR on display. This giant asterisk in only going to continue to grow. We are missing the crassness of this situation. Looks like according to the poll conducted on this site that almost 85% of our fans are in favor of playing in the CBI. That is a very strong percentage who would like to see the season continue a little longer. Who gives a damn if someone who is not a fan of UD does not want us to play. It really is none of their business and how someone from the SEC , who would like to keep the record, views this should have no influence on our decision. Our team would like to do this and a majority of our fans are in favor so let’s do it. I would think not playing in the CBI would have the greater adverse affect on our program.
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Post by ptctitan on Mar 8, 2023 7:56:39 GMT -5
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Post by ptctitan on Mar 8, 2023 8:00:01 GMT -5
Detroit Exploring Giving Antoine Davis Another ChanceIn this article is this statement by Vowels “At this time, the University of Detroit Mercy men's basketball team has not been invited or accepted any postseason invitations,” Vowels said in a statement. “We are exploring all factors if a bid was extended, but until then, we will not have any comments on the matter."
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Post by ptctitan on Mar 8, 2023 8:27:32 GMT -5
Pete Maravich played 4 games in the 1970 NIT. He sat out the consolation game versus Bob Knight's Army team due to injury. Dean Meminger of Marquette was the MVP of that tournament. How do we know that schools did not have to pay an entry fee to play in the NIT? That's generally how tournaments were run before the NCAA got its first big TV contract. And there was all the lobbying money paid indirectly to the members of the selection committee through wining and dining. The CBI and other tournaments came into existence after the NCAA bought the NIT and created a monopoly on the postseason. How many of you remember the 1974 CCA (Conference Coaches Association) tournament won by Indiana? This was an anti-competitive attempt by the NCAA to undermine the NIT by placing its more successful teams against each other so the NIT could not select them. "I'm afraid of getting bad PR" is not a reason to deprive a team of honor students the chance to play postseason if we are invited. On the other hand, a Detroit News article this morning is headlined " If Detroit's Davis was a selfish player, he'd already have the scoring record." Yep, that's really bad PR. In fact, it's so bad that the News thinks it will sell extra subscriptions so lots of people can read it behind the paywall. In fact, it's so bad that we should get permission from the News to distribute it free of charge later today. I'm tired of being afraid to seize an opportunity. Being afraid is the hallmark trait of this school since Vitale's teams reached their pinnacles. Being afraid is why we didn't hire Will Robinson to replace Bob Calihan. It's a bean counter's mentality. It's why we are not in a better conference with schools more aligned with our private and Catholic values. It's why we have deficient marketing. Being afraid is why we have made so many bad decisions over the decades.
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Post by ptctitan on Mar 8, 2023 8:59:00 GMT -5
More on the Detroit News article from Tony Paul.
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Post by fan on Mar 8, 2023 9:37:05 GMT -5
Why isn't anybody talking about Davis last shot at YSU with 4 seconds left, with a game that was in the book, YSU had 3 players guarding him. The way this thing is going somebody will blame him for taking the shot........
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Post by fan on Mar 8, 2023 9:40:53 GMT -5
Is Roger Maris in purgatory?
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Post by dtowntitan on Mar 8, 2023 10:20:59 GMT -5
It is still crazy to me that the only thing that people can say about this achievement is "5 years".... That is a sham argument. It is not difficult to look at the number of games that Antoine has played. There are MANY players who have played more games than he has, and by a significant amount, and players whose entire ncaa career took place prior to the COVID pandemic.
If this were Tyler Hansbrough, who by the way played 142 games at UNC, this story would have been all over every sports station for the entire season and he would have been lauded for how amazing a player that he was, and such an achievement of breaking this record. If this were JJ Redick, who played in 139 games, this would be the exact same discussion. David Lighty played in 157 games while at OSU, were any of his accolades discounted because of the number of games that he played in, or because of any postseason or exempt tournaments his team played in? If Antoine was setting this record playing for Duke, UNC, Kentucky, etc. this discussion would be entirely different.
Yes, the rules of the game are different today. Yes, there is the 3-point line. Yes, Pete shot a free throw every time he was fouled. Yes, team scoring averages were extremely inflated compared to today's game. We can sit here and dissect everything about this scenario.
Do we hear anyone discounting Steph Curry as being the greatest 3-point shooter in the history of the NBA because the playing style is different today than what it was in the 80s and 90s? Do we discount Bill Russell's 11 rings because the average height of players in his era was 6'4"? Just stop with the BS. Get the team to the CBI however it needs to be done. Claim the record. Anyone that has a problem with that should find something more significant in their life to be upset about.
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