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Post by udballer on Feb 15, 2024 21:37:36 GMT -5
This is a miserable season so far, and no need to pile on or provide additional criticism after finally breaking the streak. Rather, I would just like to point out two student-athletes who have chosen to play college basketball the way it was intended: Tank. MD is right - there was no reason to predict this last year. He showed a few flashes early last season, fell into disfavor because he was struggling to understand the team concept we were trying to incorporate, and then ended the season on a high note as a key player in our biggest game, the season-ending loss to Youngstown. But there was no reason to say absolutely he was going to bust out this season. I liked what I saw in his game and was fairly confident of seeing a nice improvement, and expected him to be a starter. But I wasn't sure if his ball-handling and outside shooting were sufficient. He had a funny-looking outside shot and it's a little less awkward now, but he'll never be confused with AD. Yet his competitive nature and hard work have resulted in an amazing season. At the end of last year, who would have taken Marcus over Jones? I think I would have, because Jones seems a big more of a passive role player-type, but Jones is 6-8 with a beautiful outside stroke. Jones is averaging 20 minutes and 5.5 pts per game at OU. Nice improvements from his freshman stats but certainly nowhere near what Tank has done. You could argue that Jones is on a better team, has to share his minutes with a more competitive roster, and has a different role, but still - Tank has been more impressive in his sophomore year. Tobin. Even though he has moments when he looks like he wants to shoot but isn't quite sure what to do...by and large he looked like he belongs on the court last night. When called, he was ready. Whatever you need Coach, I'm ready. Why does a walk-on become more than a walk-on? Last season, someone on the coaching staff told me that he was nothing more than a guy who comes in for the last minute after a game's been decided. Why does he work harder than most of the scholarship players? For what reason? Did he know he'd someday get the chance he had last night? How great it must have felt to actually be part of the on-court reason we finally won a game. Good for him. And good for the Titans. This mirrors (exactly) MD Jr's halftime comments. Basically said Marcus listens to him most, Tobin listens to him second-most... and nobody else listens to him. 😁
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Post by upbasketballfan on Feb 16, 2024 1:46:56 GMT -5
This is a miserable season so far, and no need to pile on or provide additional criticism after finally breaking the streak. Rather, I would just like to point out two student-athletes who have chosen to play college basketball the way it was intended: Tank. MD is right - there was no reason to predict this last year. He showed a few flashes early last season, fell into disfavor because he was struggling to understand the team concept we were trying to incorporate, and then ended the season on a high note as a key player in our biggest game, the season-ending loss to Youngstown. But there was no reason to say absolutely he was going to bust out this season. I liked what I saw in his game and was fairly confident of seeing a nice improvement, and expected him to be a starter. But I wasn't sure if his ball-handling and outside shooting were sufficient. He had a funny-looking outside shot and it's a little less awkward now, but he'll never be confused with AD. Yet his competitive nature and hard work have resulted in an amazing season. At the end of last year, who would have taken Marcus over Jones? I think I would have, because Jones seems a big more of a passive role player-type, but Jones is 6-8 with a beautiful outside stroke. Jones is averaging 20 minutes and 5.5 pts per game at OU. Nice improvements from his freshman stats but certainly nowhere near what Tank has done. You could argue that Jones is on a better team, has to share his minutes with a more competitive roster, and has a different role, but still - Tank has been more impressive in his sophomore year. Tobin. Even though he has moments when he looks like he wants to shoot but isn't quite sure what to do...by and large he looked like he belongs on the court last night. When called, he was ready. Whatever you need Coach, I'm ready. Why does a walk-on become more than a walk-on? Last season, someone on the coaching staff told me that he was nothing more than a guy who comes in for the last minute after a game's been decided. Why does he work harder than most of the scholarship players? For what reason? Did he know he'd someday get the chance he had last night? How great it must have felt to actually be part of the on-court reason we finally won a game. Good for him. And good for the Titans. This mirrors (exactly) MD Jr's halftime comments. Basically said Marcus listens to him most, Tobin listens to him second-most... and nobody else listens to him. 😁 That should have been corrected before the 10th game of the season and for a program that is so secretive about everything, that laundry should not be aired out in public. My way or the highway sometimes is a good policy. Catering to Toatley and Bozoton probably did a lot more damage then good. The tail can’t wag the dog!!
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Post by ptctitan on Feb 16, 2024 5:49:48 GMT -5
As to who is listening, I think they are all listening. But for many, it takes longer to comprehend what is being demanded of them by the coach. That is why the better programs have a consistent core of players from year to year. Why do you think that in the end, our coaches turn to multi-year walk-ons as subs? Pink and Tobin understand the system better. Kyle understands the system better. Edoardo came in late and it has taken him until just a little while ago to figure out that he is not a guard. And he still forgets his FT technique.
Resetting the team each year with a bunch of free agents (I mean transfers) is an iffy process. Look at Arkansas and Michigan. In the HL, it is not a coincidence that the teams at the top of the league have cores of at least 3-4 players in their rotations who are at least in their second years under their coaches. Several of them also used summer trips to build cohesion. It may be that the new transfer rules and the portal have made obsolete the system that worked well at TXSO because now the supply of transfers is so huge compared to 2012-2018, and the stigma of taking lots of transfers no longer exists.
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Post by upbasketballfan on Feb 16, 2024 8:43:58 GMT -5
As to who is listening, I think they are all listening. But for many, it takes longer to comprehend what is being demanded of them by the coach. That is why the better programs have a consistent core of players from year to year. Why do you think that in the end, our coaches turn to multi-year walk-ons as subs? Pink and Tobin understand the system better. Kyle understands the system better. Edoardo came in late and it has taken him until just a little while ago to figure out that he is not a guard. And he still forgets his FT technique. Resetting the team each year with a bunch of free agents (I mean transfers) is an iffy process. Look at Arkansas and Michigan. In the HL, it is not a coincidence that the teams at the top of the league have cores of at least 3-4 players in their rotations who are at least in their second years under their coaches. Several of them also used summer trips to build cohesion. It may be that the new transfer rules and the portal have made obsolete the system that worked well at TXSO because now the supply of transfers is so huge compared to 2012-2018, and the stigma of taking lots of transfers no longer exists. Except Green Bay who has only one returning player but a good young coach. They have a team of guys our present Coaching Staff would never consider or have any idea how to utilize their potential! Obsolete, overrated and in way over their heads best describes this group of imposters! I think the reason the so called better programs maintain a base is that their players recognize that the coaching staffs at those schools have something to offer. One they work with our staff for awhile they realize we are imposters and they leave as we saw last year sometimes with no where else to go but getting away looks better to them.
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Post by Commissioner on Feb 16, 2024 8:53:11 GMT -5
As to who is listening, I think they are all listening. But for many, it takes longer to comprehend what is being demanded of them by the coach. That is why the better programs have a consistent core of players from year to year. Why do you think that in the end, our coaches turn to multi-year walk-ons as subs? Pink and Tobin understand the system better. Kyle understands the system better. Edoardo came in late and it has taken him until just a little while ago to figure out that he is not a guard. And he still forgets his FT technique. Resetting the team each year with a bunch of free agents (I mean transfers) is an iffy process. Look at Arkansas and Michigan. In the HL, it is not a coincidence that the teams at the top of the league have cores of at least 3-4 players in their rotations who are at least in their second years under their coaches. Several of them also used summer trips to build cohesion. It may be that the new transfer rules and the portal have made obsolete the system that worked well at TXSO because now the supply of transfers is so huge compared to 2012-2018, and the stigma of taking lots of transfers no longer exists. Except Green Bay who has only one returning player but a good young coach. They have a team of guys our present Coaching Staff would never consider or have any idea how to utilize their potential! Obsolete, overrated and in way over their heads best describes this group of imposters! Yes, but remember, Green Bay is a historic rise--they could well end up with the biggest one year improvement in NCAA history. Many years ago in my season previews I did an analysis of the most improved Horizon League teams (from one year to the next) since the league took more or less its present form in the mid-1990s. Improving by even 10 games in a season is a big deal--very few teams do that. That might have changed in the days of the portal, but I doubt it has changed much--as others note, the portal is certainly no guarantee of rapid improvement. Of course, that's what is depressing. In a best case scenario, we might be competitive in two years. That would mean getting up to 12 or 13 wins next year, and making another big leap to 19-22 wins the following year. But that is really, really unlikely. UD has played basketball for 115 years. Only once --ONCE--have we improved by 10 or more games in a season. That was 2010, when we finished 20-14 after going 7-23 the year before. Green Bay's run this year is historic, and people should appreciate that.
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Post by Commissioner on Feb 16, 2024 9:03:47 GMT -5
Another way to look at the number I just posted above: obviously, it's much easier to improve by 10 games in a season if you lost a lot the year before. Since WWII, the Titans have had 13 seasons with single-digit wins (not counting this year). How have we done:
1949: Plus 5 games, from 7-15 to 12-10. 1971: Plus 6.5 games, from 7-18 to 14-12. 1982: Plus 1 game, from 9-18 to 10-17. 1985: Plus 8 games, from to 8-20 to 16-12 1988: Minus 1 game, from 7-21 to 7-23. 1989: Plus 1 game, from 7-23 to 7-21. 1990: Plus 3 games, from 7-21 to 10-18. 1992: Plus 2.5 games, from 9-19 to 12-17 2009: No change, 7-23 to 7-23. 2010: Plus 11 games, from 7-23 to 20-14. 2018: Minus .5 game, from 8-23 to 8-24. 2019: Plus 3.5 games, from 8-24 to 11-20. 2021: Plus 8.5 games, from to 8-23 to 12-10.
Average improvement: 3.5 games.
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Post by ptctitan on Feb 16, 2024 10:41:09 GMT -5
As to who is listening, I think they are all listening. But for many, it takes longer to comprehend what is being demanded of them by the coach. That is why the better programs have a consistent core of players from year to year. Why do you think that in the end, our coaches turn to multi-year walk-ons as subs? Pink and Tobin understand the system better. Kyle understands the system better. Edoardo came in late and it has taken him until just a little while ago to figure out that he is not a guard. And he still forgets his FT technique. Resetting the team each year with a bunch of free agents (I mean transfers) is an iffy process. Look at Arkansas and Michigan. In the HL, it is not a coincidence that the teams at the top of the league have cores of at least 3-4 players in their rotations who are at least in their second years under their coaches. Several of them also used summer trips to build cohesion. It may be that the new transfer rules and the portal have made obsolete the system that worked well at TXSO because now the supply of transfers is so huge compared to 2012-2018, and the stigma of taking lots of transfers no longer exists. Except Green Bay who has only one returning player but a good young coach. They have a team of guys our present Coaching Staff would never consider or have any idea how to utilize their potential! Obsolete, overrated and in way over their heads best describes this group of imposters! I think the reason the so called better programs maintain a base is that their players recognize that the coaching staffs at those schools have something to offer. One they work with our staff for awhile they realize we are imposters and they leave as we saw last year sometimes with no where else to go but getting away looks better to them. But if Wicks did this every year for 5 or 6 years, would GB sustain this year's success? One other difference. Wicks had 7 new guys signed by May 1st and had the chance to work all summer with them. We didn't. We had a lot of roster turnover and uncertainty through the end of August.
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Post by nctitan on Feb 16, 2024 15:09:45 GMT -5
Except Green Bay who has only one returning player but a good young coach. They have a team of guys our present Coaching Staff would never consider or have any idea how to utilize their potential! Obsolete, overrated and in way over their heads best describes this group of imposters! Yes, but remember, Green Bay is a historic rise--they could well end up with the biggest one year improvement in NCAA history. Many years ago in my season previews I did an analysis of the most improved Horizon League teams (from one year to the next) since the league took more or less its present form in the mid-1990s. Improving by even 10 games in a season is a big deal--very few teams do that. That might have changed in the days of the portal, but I doubt it has changed much--as others note, the portal is certainly no guarantee of rapid improvement. Of course, that's what is depressing. In a best case scenario, we might be competitive in two years. That would mean getting up to 12 or 13 wins next year, and making another big leap to 19-22 wins the following year. But that is really, really unlikely. UD has played basketball for 115 years. Only once --ONCE--have we improved by 10 or more games in a season. That was 2010, when we finished 20-14 after going 7-23 the year before. Green Bay's run this year is historic, and people should appreciate that. Our women won five games last year, 15 already this year with lots more to go. A big round of applause for the Lady Titans!!!
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Post by motorcitysam on Feb 16, 2024 16:21:33 GMT -5
As to who is listening, I think they are all listening. But for many, it takes longer to comprehend what is being demanded of them by the coach. That is why the better programs have a consistent core of players from year to year. Why do you think that in the end, our coaches turn to multi-year walk-ons as subs? Pink and Tobin understand the system better. Kyle understands the system better. Edoardo came in late and it has taken him until just a little while ago to figure out that he is not a guard. And he still forgets his FT technique. Resetting the team each year with a bunch of free agents (I mean transfers) is an iffy process. Look at Arkansas and Michigan. In the HL, it is not a coincidence that the teams at the top of the league have cores of at least 3-4 players in their rotations who are at least in their second years under their coaches. Several of them also used summer trips to build cohesion. It may be that the new transfer rules and the portal have made obsolete the system that worked well at TXSO because now the supply of transfers is so huge compared to 2012-2018, and the stigma of taking lots of transfers no longer exists. Also, it's probably easier to get players admitted into Texas Southern, and the Houston area is still a good recruiting base. I've never been there, but I have heard that Texas Southern is a fun place to be a student athlete, despite the fact that they aren't exactly awash with cash.
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Post by motorcitysam on Feb 16, 2024 16:45:27 GMT -5
Except Green Bay who has only one returning player but a good young coach. They have a team of guys our present Coaching Staff would never consider or have any idea how to utilize their potential! Obsolete, overrated and in way over their heads best describes this group of imposters! I think the reason the so called better programs maintain a base is that their players recognize that the coaching staffs at those schools have something to offer. One they work with our staff for awhile they realize we are imposters and they leave as we saw last year sometimes with no where else to go but getting away looks better to them. But if Wicks did this every year for 5 or 6 years, would GB sustain this year's success? One other difference. Wicks had 7 new guys signed by May 1st and had the chance to work all summer with them. We didn't. We had a lot of roster turnover and uncertainty through the end of August. Very true. Also, what made our offseason frustrating was the fact that at one point it did appear we had a lot of players committed and signed early. Hurst was already in the fold when the 2022-23 season ended. We got news of Coleman's commitment in early April. Mak Manciel on April 21. Alex T on May 4. Tovar and Jank in Mid May. Kuac on May 27. Toatley on June 9. Fuller on June 14. It appeared as if we were going to have a team with some height and experience, although most of the players had not produced big numbers on the D1 stage. I was cautiously optimistic, thinking we'd have time to get those guys working together and learning the system with plenty of time before the season started.
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Post by akhorey on Feb 16, 2024 17:38:10 GMT -5
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Post by lurker on Feb 16, 2024 17:44:31 GMT -5
But if Wicks did this every year for 5 or 6 years, would GB sustain this year's success? One other difference. Wicks had 7 new guys signed by May 1st and had the chance to work all summer with them. We didn't. We had a lot of roster turnover and uncertainty through the end of August. Very true. Also, what made our offseason frustrating was the fact that at one point it did appear we had a lot of players committed and signed early. Hurst was already in the fold when the 2022-23 season ended. We got news of Coleman's commitment in early April. Mak Manciel on April 21. Alex T on May 4. Tovar and Jank in Mid May. Kuac on May 27. Toatley on June 9. Fuller on June 14. It appeared as if we were going to have a team with some height and experience, although most of the players had not produced big numbers on the D1 stage. I was cautiously optimistic, thinking we'd have time to get those guys working together and learning the system with plenty of time before the season started. You are wrong again. More than half the players you mention signed after the regular signing period
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Post by motorcitysam on Feb 17, 2024 11:56:58 GMT -5
That's a good read, Alex. Thanks for posting it.
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Post by upbasketballfan on Feb 18, 2024 1:06:45 GMT -5
But if Wicks did this every year for 5 or 6 years, would GB sustain this year's success? One other difference. Wicks had 7 new guys signed by May 1st and had the chance to work all summer with them. We didn't. We had a lot of roster turnover and uncertainty through the end of August. Very true. Also, what made our offseason frustrating was the fact that at one point it did appear we had a lot of players committed and signed early. Hurst was already in the fold when the 2022-23 season ended. We got news of Coleman's commitment in early April. Mak Manciel on April 21. Alex T on May 4. Tovar and Jank in Mid May. Kuac on May 27. Toatley on June 9. Fuller on June 14. It appeared as if we were going to have a team with some height and experience, although most of the players had not produced big numbers on the D1 stage. I was cautiously optimistic, thinking we'd have time to get those guys working together and learning the system with plenty of time before the season started. Wicks was doing his job signing players early he didn’t have an unfair advantage or any advantage at all he just out worked us he was out recruiting players not busy trying to promote Twan!!!! One advantage Wicks does have is he doesn’t have to drag along his deadbeat son! Mike Davis is a good father trying to help his kids! We should all be responsible for our choices!
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Post by ptctitan on Feb 18, 2024 5:23:25 GMT -5
Wicks was doing his job signing players early he didn’t have an unfair advantage or any advantage at all he just out worked us he was out recruiting players not busy trying to promote Twan!!!! One advantage Wicks does have is he doesn’t have to drag along his deadbeat son! Mike Davis is a good father trying to help his kids! We should all be responsible for our choices! Wicks did hire the older brother of Noah Reynolds as an assistant. And he kept 3 players from the prior year. But he did take a number of D-2 players.
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